{"id":4264,"date":"2022-09-27T13:12:00","date_gmt":"2022-09-27T11:12:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/?p=4264"},"modified":"2022-09-27T11:41:08","modified_gmt":"2022-09-27T09:41:08","slug":"au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/","title":{"rendered":"Au commencement \u00e9tait&#8230; \u2013 David Graeber &#038; David Wengrow 2\/3 &#8211; Un nouveau cadre pour penser l\u2019\u00e9tat"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<p>On continue <strong>la s\u00e9rie sur le livre <a href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/20\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-1-3-abattre-les-mythes-sur-les-origines-des-societes\/\">\u00ab\u00a0Au commencement \u00e9tait&#8230;\u00a0\u00bb de David Graeber et David Wengrow<\/a><\/strong>. La <strong>derni\u00e8re fois<\/strong> on a vu comment le livre<strong> remet en question les grands mythes des origines<\/strong> et propose une approche <strong>plus scientifique<\/strong> pour l\u2019analyse des origines des soci\u00e9t\u00e9s humaines. Aujourd\u2019hui on va voir ce qui me semble \u00eatre <strong>un des apports principaux du livre.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Car le livre ne se contente pas de faire un gros bashing de concepts existants. <strong>Il propose de nouvelles choses.<\/strong> Et le principal apport th\u00e9orique est sans doute une nouvelle fa\u00e7on de <strong>conceptualiser ce qu\u2019est un \u00e9tat.<\/strong> Si la notion de ce qu\u2019est un \u00e9tat aujourd\u2019hui est assez intuitive, cette approche intuitive pose un probl\u00e8me&nbsp;:<strong> \u00e0 partir de quand peut-on parler d\u2019\u00e9tat pour des soci\u00e9t\u00e9s pass\u00e9&nbsp;? Quels en sont les caract\u00e9ristiques objectives&nbsp;?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<div id=\"ez-toc-container\" class=\"ez-toc-v2_0_82_2 counter-hierarchy ez-toc-counter ez-toc-grey ez-toc-container-direction\">\n<div class=\"ez-toc-title-container\">\n<p class=\"ez-toc-title\" style=\"cursor:inherit\">Table des mati\u00e8res<\/p>\n<span class=\"ez-toc-title-toggle\"><a href=\"#\" class=\"ez-toc-pull-right ez-toc-btn ez-toc-btn-xs ez-toc-btn-default ez-toc-toggle\" aria-label=\"Toggle Table of Content\"><span class=\"ez-toc-js-icon-con\"><span class=\"\"><span class=\"eztoc-hide\" style=\"display:none;\">Toggle<\/span><span class=\"ez-toc-icon-toggle-span\"><svg style=\"fill: #999;color:#999\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" class=\"list-377408\" width=\"20px\" height=\"20px\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" fill=\"none\"><path d=\"M6 6H4v2h2V6zm14 0H8v2h12V6zM4 11h2v2H4v-2zm16 0H8v2h12v-2zM4 16h2v2H4v-2zm16 0H8v2h12v-2z\" fill=\"currentColor\"><\/path><\/svg><svg style=\"fill: #999;color:#999\" class=\"arrow-unsorted-368013\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" width=\"10px\" height=\"10px\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" version=\"1.2\" baseProfile=\"tiny\"><path d=\"M18.2 9.3l-6.2-6.3-6.2 6.3c-.2.2-.3.4-.3.7s.1.5.3.7c.2.2.4.3.7.3h11c.3 0 .5-.1.7-.3.2-.2.3-.5.3-.7s-.1-.5-.3-.7zM5.8 14.7l6.2 6.3 6.2-6.3c.2-.2.3-.5.3-.7s-.1-.5-.3-.7c-.2-.2-.4-.3-.7-.3h-11c-.3 0-.5.1-.7.3-.2.2-.3.5-.3.7s.1.5.3.7z\"\/><\/svg><\/span><\/span><\/span><\/a><\/span><\/div>\n<nav><ul class='ez-toc-list ez-toc-list-level-1 ' ><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-2'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-1\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Libertes_et_dominations_fondamentales\" >Libert\u00e9s et dominations fondamentales<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-2'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-2\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Les_3_aspects_de_letat_moderne\" >Les 3 aspects de l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne<\/a><ul class='ez-toc-list-level-3' ><li class='ez-toc-heading-level-3'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-3\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#La_Souverainete\" >La Souverainet\u00e9&nbsp;<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-3'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-4\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#La_Bureaucratie\" >La Bureaucratie&nbsp;<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-3'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-5\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#La_competition_politique\" >La comp\u00e9tition politique&nbsp;<\/a><\/li><\/ul><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-2'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-6\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Societes_de_1er_et_2eme_ordre\" >Soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de 1er et 2\u00e8me ordre<\/a><ul class='ez-toc-list-level-3' ><li class='ez-toc-heading-level-3'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-7\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Exemples_de_societes_de_premier_ordre\" >Exemples de soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de premier ordre&nbsp;:<\/a><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-3'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-8\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Exemples_de_societes_de_second_ordre\" >Exemples de soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de second ordre&nbsp;:<\/a><\/li><\/ul><\/li><li class='ez-toc-page-1 ez-toc-heading-level-2'><a class=\"ez-toc-link ez-toc-heading-9\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/#Quels_chemins_vers_letat_moderne\" >Quel(s) chemin(s) vers l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne<\/a><\/li><\/ul><\/nav><\/div>\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Libertes_et_dominations_fondamentales\"><\/span>Libert\u00e9s et dominations fondamentales<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>De fa\u00e7on assez logique pour un\/des penseurs anarchistes l<strong>a d\u00e9finition de l\u2019\u00e9tat s\u2019appuie sur une d\u00e9finition de libert\u00e9s et dominations<\/strong>. Alors quelles sont les libert\u00e9s fondamentales&nbsp;? pour cela le plus simple semble de r\u00e9fl\u00e9chir \u00e0 <strong>que faire face \u00e0 un \u00e9tat oppressif&nbsp;?<\/strong> <\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"500\" height=\"300\" data-attachment-id=\"4272\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/help-im-being-repressed\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/help-Im-being-repressed.gif?fit=500%2C300&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"500,300\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"help-Im-being-repressed\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/help-Im-being-repressed.gif?fit=500%2C300&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/help-Im-being-repressed.gif?resize=500%2C300&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-4272\"\/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<p><strong>3 options\u00a0:<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\"><li><strong>D\u00e9sob\u00e9ir<\/strong><\/li><li><strong>Se barrer<\/strong> hors de l\u2019influence de cet \u00e9tat<\/li><li><strong>Changer l\u2019organisation sociale<\/strong>, l\u2019ordre de la soci\u00e9t\u00e9.<\/li><\/ul>\n\n\n\n<p>Face \u00e0 ces trois libert\u00e9s fondamentales, <strong>quels sont<\/strong> <strong>les outils de domination qui permettent de s\u2019y opposer&nbsp;? &nbsp;<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\"><li><strong>La violence,<\/strong> simple, efficace, basique&nbsp;: <em>\u00ab\u00a0tu veux d\u00e9sob\u00e9ir&nbsp;? te barrer&nbsp;? tout changer&nbsp;?\u00a0\u00bb<\/em> bam mandale dans ta gueule. On voit bien&#8230;<\/li><li><strong>Le savoir,<\/strong> qu\u2019il soit religieux ou technique il permet d\u2019exercer une contrainte plus souple mais tr\u00e8s r\u00e9elle&nbsp;: <em>\u00ab\u00a0Ah tu veux te barrer&nbsp;? mais seul moi sait comment trouver \u00e0 manger, et sans mes pr\u00eatres pour apaiser les dieux tu n\u2019as aucune chance<\/em>.\u00a0\u00bb<\/li><li><strong>Le charisme, <\/strong>la contrainte est encore plus douce et la menace n\u2019a m\u00eame pas \u00e0 \u00eatre formul\u00e9, si tu restes et que tu ob\u00e9is <em>c\u2019est bien parce que tu aimes ton chef au fond tu voudrais m\u00eame \u00eatre comme lui. <strong>&nbsp;<\/strong><\/em><\/li><\/ul>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Les_3_aspects_de_letat_moderne\"><\/span>Les 3 aspects de l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>C\u2019est \u00e0 pr\u00e9sent <strong>ces trois formes de domination<\/strong> qui nous donnent diff\u00e9rents aspects des \u00e9tats modernes&nbsp;<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"La_Souverainete\"><\/span><strong>La Souverainet\u00e9<\/strong>&nbsp;<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>c\u2019est-\u00e0-dire la possibilit\u00e9 de <strong>contraindre les actions par la violence \u00ab\u00a0l\u00e9gitime\u00a0\u00bb de l\u2019\u00e9tat<\/strong>.&nbsp;Bon, je pense qu&rsquo;on voit tous bien ce que c&rsquo;est. <em>C&rsquo;est marrant, avec la violence pas besoin de longues explications&#8230;<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"216\" height=\"180\" data-attachment-id=\"4283\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/pig\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/pig.gif?fit=216%2C180&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"216,180\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"pig\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/pig.gif?fit=216%2C180&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/pig.gif?resize=216%2C180&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"1312\" class=\"wp-image-4283\"\/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"La_Bureaucratie\"><\/span><strong>La Bureaucratie<\/strong>&nbsp;<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Elle seule donne \u00e0 l\u2019\u00e9tat possibilit\u00e9 de <strong>d\u00e9multiplier le contr\u00f4le sur un large territoire et une large population<\/strong>. (<em>note, je renvoie d&rsquo;ailleurs au <strong><a href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2018\/08\/07\/bureaucratie-david-graeber\/\">livre de David Graeber sur le sujet<\/a><\/strong><\/em>)<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Elle s\u2019appuie sur le <strong>contr\u00f4le de l\u2019information<\/strong>. C\u2019est-\u00e0-dire l<strong>a manipulation d\u2019un savoir religieux ou technique<\/strong> dont une part n\u2019est accessible qu\u2019\u00e0 des initi\u00e9s. (<em>et il suffit d\u2019ouvrir une d\u00e9claration d\u2019imp\u00f4t et toutes ses annexes pour comprendre que ce c\u00f4t\u00e9 \u00ab&nbsp;savoir inaccessible&nbsp;\u00bb n\u2019a pas disparu avec les cultes \u00e0 myst\u00e8re<\/em>).<\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"256\" height=\"256\" data-attachment-id=\"4284\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/wololo\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/wololo.gif?fit=256%2C256&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"256,256\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"wololo\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/wololo.gif?fit=256%2C256&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/wololo.gif?resize=256%2C256&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-4284\"\/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"La_competition_politique\"><\/span><strong>La comp\u00e9tition politique&nbsp;<\/strong><span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Qu\u2019elle soit \u00ab&nbsp;<strong>d\u00e9mocratique<\/strong>&nbsp;\u00bb ou \u00ab&nbsp;<strong>politique h\u00e9ro\u00efque<\/strong>&nbsp;\u00bb, elle permet <strong>l\u2019apparition <\/strong>et la <strong>distinction <\/strong>d\u2019une <strong>\u00e9lite \/ aristocratie qui assure sa reproduction sociale.<\/strong> <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Cette reproduction de l\u2019\u00e9lite passe par <strong>le contr\u00f4le des diff\u00e9rentes formes de capital<\/strong>&nbsp;: \u00e9conomique, mais surtout social et culturel. Le <strong><em>\u00ab&nbsp;charisme&nbsp;\u00bb<\/em><\/strong> n\u2019\u00e9tant souvent rien d\u2019autre qu\u2019<strong>une juste maitrise des codes culturels et un bon r\u00e9seau social de connaissances et d\u2019influences<\/strong>.<\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"480\" height=\"360\" data-attachment-id=\"4285\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/politician\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/politician.gif?fit=480%2C360&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"480,360\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"politician\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/politician.gif?fit=480%2C360&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/politician.gif?resize=480%2C360&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-4285\"\/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Societes_de_1er_et_2eme_ordre\"><\/span>Soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de 1<sup>er<\/sup> et 2<sup>\u00e8me<\/sup> ordre<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>L\u00e0 ou cette d\u00e9finition en 3 aspects est int\u00e9ressante, c\u2019est qu\u2019elle fournit plusieurs \u00ab\u00a0routes\u00a0\u00bb pour une soci\u00e9t\u00e9 pour se rapprocher de l\u2019\u00e9tat. <strong>On distingue alors les soci\u00e9t\u00e9s qui ne sont pas des \u00e9tats en soci\u00e9t\u00e9 de 1<sup>er<\/sup> ou 2<sup>nd<\/sup> ordre selon qu\u2019elles ont 1 ou 2 des aspects de l\u2019\u00e9tat.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Le livre fournit des exemples \u00e9loquents de soci\u00e9t\u00e9s anciennes qui peuvent \u00eatre consid\u00e9r\u00e9 de 1<sup>er<\/sup> ou de 2<sup>nd<\/sup> ordre, selon les diff\u00e9rents aspects qu\u2019elles pr\u00e9sentent. J\u2019ai not\u00e9&nbsp;:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Exemples_de_societes_de_premier_ordre\"><\/span>Exemples de soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de premier ordre&nbsp;:<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\"><li><strong>Les Olm\u00e8ques<\/strong>, peuple avec concurrence politique forte (jeu de balle) mais sans souverainet\u00e9 ni bureaucratie r\u00e9ellement d\u00e9velopp\u00e9e.<\/li><li><strong>Les Chav\u00edn de Hu\u00e1ntar<\/strong> : peuple ou le pouvoir \u00e9tait bas\u00e9 sur des secret \u00e9sot\u00e9rique (bureaucratie) mais sans souverainet\u00e9 ou ar\u00e8ne politique manifeste.<\/li><li><strong>Les Natchez&nbsp;:<\/strong> peuple avec souverainet\u00e9 (chef\/roi ayant un pouvoir de vie ou de mort sur ses sujets) mais sans bureaucratie ou ar\u00e8ne politique (hors de son entourage imm\u00e9diat le chef perdait tout pouvoir).<\/li><\/ul>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-large is-resized\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" data-attachment-id=\"4291\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/image-1-11\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?fit=453%2C1125&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"453,1125\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image-1\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?fit=412%2C1024&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?resize=103%2C256&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-4291\" width=\"103\" height=\"256\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?resize=412%2C1024&amp;ssl=1 412w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?resize=121%2C300&amp;ssl=1 121w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?resize=109%2C270&amp;ssl=1 109w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-1.png?w=453&amp;ssl=1 453w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 103px) 100vw, 103px\" \/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h3 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Exemples_de_societes_de_second_ordre\"><\/span>Exemples de soci\u00e9t\u00e9s de second ordre&nbsp;:<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h3>\n\n\n\n<p>Elles combinent deux des trois principes de contr\u00f4le. Elles apparaissent aussi comme caract\u00e9ris\u00e9es par des arrangements sociaux <strong>beaucoup plus violents et parfois instable<\/strong> (ayant tendance soit \u00e0 \u00e9voluer en \u00e9tat, soit \u00e0 retourner au premier ordre).<\/p>\n\n\n\n<ul class=\"wp-block-list\"><li><strong>Souverainet\u00e9 et bureaucratie<\/strong>&nbsp;: Ce sont les caract\u00e9ristiques qu\u2019on reconnait aux \u00ab&nbsp;premiers \u00e9tats&nbsp;\u00bb traditionnel. Le livre cite en exemple <strong>l\u2019Egypte<\/strong>. Pharaon et son administration contr\u00f4le tout, mais il n\u2019y a pas de classe politique, de comp\u00e9tition charismatique \u00e0 proprement parler.<\/li><li><strong>Souverainet\u00e9 et comp\u00e9tition politique&nbsp;:<\/strong> Le livre cite en exemple <strong>les Mayas<\/strong>, leurs chefs sont tout puissant et se livre \u00e0 une comp\u00e9tition violente, mais il n\u2019existe pas de syst\u00e8me d\u2019administration d\u00e9velopp\u00e9 qui permettent d\u2019\u00e9tendre cette domination au-del\u00e0 de cit\u00e9 \u00e9tat ou petits royaumes.<\/li><li><strong>Bureaucratie et comp\u00e9tition politique&nbsp;:<\/strong> Le livre donne en exemple <strong>les souverains m\u00e9sopotamiens<\/strong> qui prenait le contr\u00f4le de ville globalement autoorganis\u00e9e. Ceux-ci n\u2019avaient qu\u2019un pouvoir r\u00e9el assez limit\u00e9 sur l\u2019organisation et le fonctionnement des villes et de leurs institutions.<\/li><\/ul>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full is-resized\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" data-attachment-id=\"4293\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/image-2-10\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?fit=1024%2C683&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"1024,683\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image-2\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?fit=640%2C427&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?resize=512%2C342&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-4293\" width=\"512\" height=\"342\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?w=1024&amp;ssl=1 1024w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?resize=300%2C200&amp;ssl=1 300w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?resize=768%2C512&amp;ssl=1 768w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-2.png?resize=405%2C270&amp;ssl=1 405w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 512px) 100vw, 512px\" \/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\"><span class=\"ez-toc-section\" id=\"Quels_chemins_vers_letat_moderne\"><\/span>Quel(s) chemin(s) vers l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne<span class=\"ez-toc-section-end\"><\/span><\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p>A partir de l\u00e0, on a <strong>plusieurs cheminements possibles imaginables vers l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne<\/strong>, \u00e0 mesure que les diff\u00e9rents aspects de la domination \u00e9tatique se mettent en place.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>On a <strong>la vision traditionnelle<\/strong>, ou le <strong>besoin d\u2019administration<\/strong> pour faire fonctionner l<strong>es syst\u00e8mes d\u2019irrigation complexe<\/strong> se traduit par la mise en place d\u2019un <strong>syst\u00e8me hi\u00e9rarchique fort<\/strong>, menant \u00e0 la <strong>comp\u00e9tition politique<\/strong>&nbsp;:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-text-align-center\"><strong>Bureaucratie -&gt; Souverainet\u00e9 -&gt; Politique charismatique.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Mais on a aussi une variante ou des soci\u00e9t\u00e9s ont pu <strong>s\u2019autoorganiser de fa\u00e7on \u00e9galitaire pour faire fonctionner ces syst\u00e8mes complexes.<\/strong> Avant d\u2019\u00eatre <strong>conquise par leurs voisins<\/strong>, chasseurs cueilleurs violent (les <em>\u00ab&nbsp;barbares&nbsp;\u00bb<\/em>) qui leur ont<strong> imposer in fine un syst\u00e8me hi\u00e9rarchique fort<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-text-align-center\"><strong>Bureaucratie -&gt; Politique charismatique -&gt; Souverainet\u00e9.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Ou encore une variante dans laquelle <strong>des individus \u00ab&nbsp;hors norme&nbsp;\u00bb<\/strong> se voit confier <strong>peu \u00e0 peu un pouvoir exceptionnel<\/strong> pour des raisons culturelle, et qui finissent par <strong>mettre en place les moyens de leur domination.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"has-text-align-center\"><strong>Politique charismatique -&gt; Souverainet\u00e9 -&gt; Bureaucratie.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Vu comme \u00e7a, cette vision <strong>pluraliste des chemins<\/strong> est bien plus convaincante que la vision traditionnelle d\u2019un enchainement \u00ab&nbsp;simple&nbsp;\u00bb et lin\u00e9aire (<strong>bande, tribu, chefferie, \u00e9tat<\/strong>), qui rend l\u2019apparition de l\u2019\u00e9tat moderne <strong>inexorable \u00e0 partir du moment ou une soci\u00e9t\u00e9 augmente en taille<\/strong>.<\/p>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-image\">\n<figure class=\"aligncenter size-full\"><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"539\" height=\"519\" data-attachment-id=\"4296\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/image-3-10\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?fit=539%2C519&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"539,519\" data-comments-opened=\"1\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"image-3\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?fit=539%2C519&amp;ssl=1\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?resize=539%2C519&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"Le mod\u00e8le traditionnel (Fried, Service, Redman) attaqu\u00e9 par Graeber et Wengrow\" class=\"wp-image-4296\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?w=539&amp;ssl=1 539w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?resize=300%2C289&amp;ssl=1 300w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/image-3.png?resize=280%2C270&amp;ssl=1 280w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 539px) 100vw, 539px\" \/><\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n<p>Mais elle pose une question subsidiaire essentielle\u00a0: <strong>si plusieurs chemins sont possibles<\/strong>, et si certaines soci\u00e9t\u00e9s se<strong><a href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2017\/12\/05\/la-societe-contre-letat-pierre-clastres\/\"> sont arr\u00eat\u00e9es avant le stade final<\/a><\/strong> ou y ont renonc\u00e9, <strong>pourquoi sommes nous rest\u00e9s bloqu\u00e9 au stade \u00e9tatique\u00a0dans nos soci\u00e9t\u00e9s\u00a0?<\/strong>&#8230; \u00e0 suivre ! <\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>On continue la s\u00e9rie sur le livre \u00ab\u00a0Au commencement \u00e9tait&#8230;\u00a0\u00bb de David Graeber et David Wengrow. La derni\u00e8re fois on a vu comment le livre remet en question les grands mythes des origines et propose une approche plus scientifique pour l\u2019analyse des origines des soci\u00e9t\u00e9s humaines. Aujourd\u2019hui on va voir ce qui me semble \u00eatre un des apports principaux du livre. Car le livre ne se contente pas de faire un gros bashing de concepts existants. Il propose de nouvelles&#8230;<\/p>\n<p class=\"read-more\"><a class=\"btn btn-default\" href=\"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2022\/09\/27\/au-commencement-etait-david-graeber-david-wengrow-2-3-un-nouveau-cadre-pour-penser-letat\/\">Lire la suite<span class=\"screen-reader-text\"> Lire la suite<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2,"featured_media":4265,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[2,3],"tags":[18,23,43,10,11,25,9,5,16],"class_list":["post-4264","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-blog","category-liens","tag-anthropologie","tag-archeologie","tag-economie","tag-histoire","tag-livre","tag-philosophie","tag-politique","tag-science","tag-socio"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v27.5 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>Au Commencement \u00c9tait - Graeber &amp; Wengrow - 2\/3 Un nouveau cadre pour penser l\u2019\u00e9tat<\/title>\n<meta name=\"description\" content=\"2\u00e8me partie de ma revue du livre Au commencement \u00e9tait... de David Graeber et David Wengrow. 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Ces propositions donnent\u2026","rel":"","context":"Dans &quot;Blog&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Blog","link":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/category\/blog\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/Au-Commencement-Etait-Graever-Wengrow-3.png?fit=1200%2C1157&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/Au-Commencement-Etait-Graever-Wengrow-3.png?fit=1200%2C1157&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/Au-Commencement-Etait-Graever-Wengrow-3.png?fit=1200%2C1157&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/Au-Commencement-Etait-Graever-Wengrow-3.png?fit=1200%2C1157&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2022\/09\/Au-Commencement-Etait-Graever-Wengrow-3.png?fit=1200%2C1157&ssl=1&resize=1050%2C600 3x"},"classes":[]},{"id":468,"url":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2017\/02\/23\/pour-une-anthropologie-anarchiste-david-graeber\/","url_meta":{"origin":4264,"position":2},"title":"Pour une anthropologie anarchiste &#8211; David Graeber","author":"Grain","date":"23 f\u00e9vrier 2017","format":false,"excerpt":"David Graeber est un auteur, anthropologue et anarchiste, dont j'ai d\u00e9j\u00e0 parl\u00e9 ici, l\u00e0 ou encore l\u00e0. J'avais lu \"The Democracy Project\" l'ann\u00e9e derni\u00e8re, et comme j'avais bien aim\u00e9 j'en ai repris. 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Le livre rassemble en fait plusieurs essais qui traitent de la bureaucratie sous plusieurs angles et propose des r\u00e9flexions int\u00e9ressantes. Globalement j'ai encore bien aim\u00e9 ce livre de Graeber,\u2026","rel":"","context":"Dans &quot;Blog&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Blog","link":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/category\/blog\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/07\/Bureaucratie.jpg?fit=602%2C575&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/07\/Bureaucratie.jpg?fit=602%2C575&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/07\/Bureaucratie.jpg?fit=602%2C575&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x"},"classes":[]},{"id":3858,"url":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2021\/11\/18\/ondee-28-commerce-psychologique-negociation-picasso-sante\/","url_meta":{"origin":4264,"position":4},"title":"[Ond\u00e9e] #28 Commerce Psychologique Negociation Picasso Sant\u00e9","author":"Grain","date":"18 novembre 2021","format":false,"excerpt":"Une nouvelle ond\u00e9e, une nouvelle s\u00e9rie de vid\u00e9os vus ces derniers mois. Comme d'habitude un peu de tout, du long, du cours, du rigolo et du moins fun. Tzitzimitl - L'Origine du Commerce On commence avec une cha\u00eene que j'ai r\u00e9cemment d\u00e9couvert et que j'ai depuis bien ponc\u00e9: Tzitzimitl -\u2026","rel":"","context":"Dans &quot;Lu et Vu&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Lu et Vu","link":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/category\/liens\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/11\/Ondee-28.png?fit=952%2C557&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/11\/Ondee-28.png?fit=952%2C557&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/11\/Ondee-28.png?fit=952%2C557&ssl=1&resize=525%2C300 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/lignesdorages.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2021\/11\/Ondee-28.png?fit=952%2C557&ssl=1&resize=700%2C400 2x"},"classes":[]},{"id":965,"url":"https:\/\/lignesdorages.com\/index.php\/2017\/12\/05\/la-societe-contre-letat-pierre-clastres\/","url_meta":{"origin":4264,"position":5},"title":"La Soci\u00e9t\u00e9 contre l&rsquo;Etat &#8211; Pierre Clastres","author":"Grain","date":"5 d\u00e9cembre 2017","format":false,"excerpt":"Pour nous qui vivons dedans, l'\u00e9tat est une \u00e9vidence. Une de ces structures hi\u00e9rarchiques p\u00e9nibles pour tout le monde mais dont il semble pas vraiment possible de se passer. 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